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 Post subject: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:04 pm 
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Sorry about the long post, I tried to keep it as short and dry as I could. Please bear with me.

Mr Darcy is a rescue bird, his paperwork got lost so nobody knows anything about his past or his age.
The charity I work with is great with big birds, not so much with tiels, so he was fostered in various random places usually packed with bigger parrots.

For one of those weird chances he was fostered in the same home with Keith for a few weeks, and became obsessed with him. With Keith gone, he became obsessed with one of the bigger parrots.

Then he came here, and for a while he was overjoyed with all the tielness, and the sweetest boy you can imagine.
Then, after about a week, he became obsessed with Bubu. Followed him everywhere, sang to him, he was his slave basically.
At the beginning I thought it was cute, then Bubu started to get annoyed, chasing him away, and I became Darcy's enemy.

Bubu is strongly bonded with me (and I likewise), so every time Bubu was with me Darcy would get angry and attack me. He still does that, now I have a few techniques to avoid the actual bite but his behaviour remains very aggressive.
If I move it's worse. If I sit on a chair, with Bubu sitting on my shoulder, he sits near and won't attack. Will just make those little angry squeaks, short, dry, I don't know how to explain them but all my birds do that if they are angry or nervous. Tonight actually he was calm and grinding his beak while perching nearby.

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I opened a thread a while ago on TC but apart from the hormone reduction suggestion made once, it was pretty much a monologue, After a while I got bored to talk to myself and abandoned the thread.
I know there is a hormone problem, at least I think there is, but I am afraid this goes beyond something that can be solved with long nights. I used all the hormone reducing techniques and not one of my tiels is hormonal right now.

I was thinking of contacting a parrot behaviourist, but I can't pay their fees and even if I could I don't know any.
With him being a rescue bird, maybe I could find someone willing to give me some sessions for free, this is my hope.

I took Bubu away for a few days, to see if things improved.
They did, he was a much more relaxed bird, not chasing me or anyone else.
As soon as Bubu came back, Darcy got back to his crazy ways.
Sometimes I put Bubu in another room and when I do that Darcy is the sweetest boy you can imagine. He makes me give him scritches, and talk to him. He even sings to me.

When I put them to bed, Bubu goes first. I cover him, and like magic I am able to pick Darcy up, and cuddle him a little bit before putting him to bed.
I am baffled and so frustrated, I genuinely love him and want to help him!

My charity's coordinator is aware of the problem, and we had a discussion because he says that when the weather gets warmer Darcy will go to an aviary. I am against it, as I think he would be great as a pet in a house where he's the only bird around. That, or he stays here and I will have to put up with his ways.
My partner hates him with a passion because Darcy bit him too, and hard :lol: so if he doesn't change, I might have a "divorce" coming up.

Thinking of him in an aviary is unbearable, he likes to sing, interact, he is definitely not a feral bird. Who knows what happened to him to make him such a dr Jekyll/mr Hyde type.
Or maybe I am being selfish and an aviary is a good idea.

What are your thoughts?
Whatever comes to your mind, please tell me. I don't know what to do anymore.
I even thought: what if he actually loves me and doesn't want me to be around Bubu? That would be a problem without solution.


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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:24 pm 
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I think he just likes you and Bubu is a distraction for your attention.



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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:56 pm 
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I know they sometimes bite and attack their own mate if the mate is giving attentions to others, could this be the case?
This would be a disaster!

I thought of building a really huge cage (I am waiting for the wire replacement) and shut Darcy and Angelina inside for like two weeks, to see what happens. Not sure it's a good idea though. Or maybe with Trilly who is the sexy diva around here... maybe he'd fall for her?



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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:54 pm 
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He could. But once they pick one it can be hard to convert. Or who knows? It may just take some insisting.



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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:12 pm 
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Mr Darcy is a very handsome fellow!

It sounds to me like it's the other way around - he loves Bubu and doesn't want Bubu paying attention to you instead of him. When Bubu is in the other room he doesn't have to worry about you stealing Bubu away from him, so he can afford to be nice with you.

It does sound like a lot of hormones are involved in this, but you're already using the home remedy for that and there's nothing else to do along those lines. So my suggestion would be to reward Darcy for not acting jealous when you, he, and Bubu are all together. I'd start with food bribery. I hope they both love millet spray because that's the best food to use - it's big enough for two tiels to share at the same time. Hold the millet in your hand and let Darcy nibble on it, then encourage Bubu to to join the feast. Both birds will be eating from your hand at the same time and hopefully no one will be getting jealous about it. That's a start.

You can gradually work up to other enjoyable activities with both birds at the same time. But if you pay attention to Darcy first, he'll think that you're mostly interested in him and will be less worried that you're trying to steal Bubu from him. Hopefully Bubu won't be jealous that he's not #1. Once Darcy gets used to sharing you'll probably have more freedom to play with Bubu without triggering a Darcy attack.



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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 3:06 pm 
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Well, today was an interesting day in the bird room. Now that I am finally back, at least three or four hours straight, I have noticed a few new dynamics in the group. I guess part is due to the departure of Yoghi and Fifi, who were the two calm influences. I miss them both horribly but these birds of mine go on as if nothing happened.
The old group of "leaders" is gone, they are more on an equal level, all of them.

In all this Darcy seems to be the outsider. I guess that is due to the fact that he feels the need to guard Bubu, and whenever another bird gets close he is all open beak and hissing. The others don't take any notice whatsoever, going about their business, and I feel sorry for him being so tense.
Obviously nobody wants to play with him. When he first arrived here Angelina courted him relentlessly, but after a while she gave up since he would chase her and pick at her. Men!

I went in armed with a big millet spray, and basically followed your advice, Tielfan. I would offer it to him first, and then if Bubu was in the vicinity he would join... And chase Darcy away!
So I wasn't able to have them both share more than 10 seconds.
I decided to pursue Darcy, at that point. I offered him millet, which he adores, then try to give him a little head scritch.
First to him, then to another bird, random, whoever was closest. Then back to him, little head scritch, then millet.
He tried to bite me a few times, once he got me lol, but nothing compared to the crawling up my neck he does sometimes when he's really angry. He can be such a scary guy :(
He didn't try any direct aggression, I suspect it's because he knew I had yummy food so he was just waiting to get some. Even the little angry sounds were a lot less than usual.

So on one side I am very happy because I was able to touch him in Bubu's presence, on the other hand I don't think Bubu has any intention to collaborate to the plan. He is not a birds' bird in his best moments, and I suspect that all this stalking has made him nervous around Darcy.

All the food bribery didn't keep Darcy near me when Bubu moved away. Where B goes, D follows.
Something really weird I noticed is that when Bubu goes to a dish, and eats, Darcy most of the time won't join in... he will only stand there and make sure that nobody else goes near the dish.
He is so devoted, and B treats him so bad... it's a little heartbreaking to watch.

Do I go on giving him treats and rewarding him when he's good? I can do that, I genuinely enjoyed today, but the moment I have no treats he will be as hostile as ever. A temporary solution is better than no solution of course...

What about my idea of putting him in a big cage with one or two of the girls? Couldn't his being hormonal push him to accept an available partner? I don't have other males he could bond with, right now, otherwise I would really like to see him bond with another boy, since it seems that it works better for him.
The new mesh arrived today, at last, so I would be able to get him a really huge cage, and he'd be stuck in there with a possible new mate.

In all this obviously Bubu is disgusted by the lack of daily cuddles, so we have to have cuddle time when everyone else is in bed. I hope that sleeping a bit less won't affect him. I really don't need a cranky Bubu right now :lol:



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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 3:44 pm 
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Keep on trying, this was just the first day. I don't know how much progress you'll be able to make with any of them but there will probably be some improvement eventually. If you can get two or three birds eating millet at the same time it won't be as easy for Bubu to chase them all away, so maybe he'll relax a little and decide to share. Putting Darcy in the same cage with a couple of hens might make him decide to switch allegiance and maybe it won't. I've got a few birds whose allegiance I'd like to change and so far keeping them in a cage with more desirable companions isn't working. But all the birds get to spend a lot of time together out of the cage so they're not being separated from their inappropriate companions all that much. It would probably work better if I actually kept them in different rooms with no shared time.



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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:05 am 
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All very interesting Barbara...
You sure do have a problem with him...
I'm not sure what the answer is, I'd definitely
keep up the treat, treatment and see how it goes..
Also have you tried him in his own cage?
Maybe a little he time, would do some good.
I hope you can find something which helps you, its horrid getting bitten all the time. I have a
P'let like that...little terror!
I guess its the only way they have to tell us they are jealous.. Good luck, keep us updated on how its going.



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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:39 pm 
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Today it was a bloody disaster.
I woke up extremely late, could't get some sleep until 10am this morning so I opened the cages at 2pm... I know it's bad for them to miss so much of their day but when my insomnia kicks in it takes a few days/weeks to tame it.
They have plenty of food and all in the cage but they are so used to free ranging, they hate to be left in during the day.

The problem was I had to do stuff around the house and Keith & Bubu kept following, which made Darcy following us like a crazy bat, and all kind of drama ensued.
There is no way I can move without causing chaos.
My door net has been eaten by the Alex so, until I get a new one, keeping the birds inside the bird room is a nightmare. I live in dread of killing another one of them trapping them in the shutting door, like it happened with George, and that's why I HATE shutting the bird room door.
I really need to get the door sorted.

In all this Bubu stole one of my tee-shirts and tucked it under the bed as a nest, and kept lunging at my legs from there every time I walked by. Darcy lunged at me from the air. A splendid day.
Bubu doesn't even have a girlfriend, I keep repeating that to him, get a gf then we talk about nests. What's bad is that he hadn't done that for a very long time.

When I sit here in the bird room, everything gets back to normal.
I have no idea why, but all of them are more active with playing and eating when I am with them. When I am away, they pretty much sit on a perch and meditate (I guess, or maybe nap).

The situation Bubu-Darcy is getting worse. I think I have triggered Bubu's jealousy and now he chases Darcy in a way he didn't use before. Darcy is now afraid of going near him, so he follows him at a couple of feet distance and cries.

What absolutely baffles me is that Bubu is not aggressive towards Keith, who basically lives between the top of my head and under my chin. They are not best of friends, but they respect their personal space and don't fight.
Shouldn't he be attacking Keith as well?

I feel like I am making more damage than good, right now.
I have all the best intentions, and I love Darcy a lot, with all his craziness, but I feel completely powerless at helping him.

I was thinking about Tsuka, who with all his craziness for some reason has always been one of my favourite tiels on TC.
How Casey deals with it? Is there anything of what she does that can apply to my Darcy?

And you Jan, how do you deal with your little terror?

It's almost end of January now, and soon there will be talks about aviaries and I would feel such a failure and failing him if I don't find a solution. I don't want him to become a cuddly bird, even though I know he can be, but this situation is bad.
What can I say, I am not as gutsy as you guys, the idea of an angry and unhappy bird chasing me forever makes me really miserable.

I even thought of getting a new tiel, someone Darcy has never been before, and put them together hoping that someone new might be more appealing to him. Wishful thinking of course, I know :(



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 Post subject: Re: Mr Darcy
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:58 pm 
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Once a bird has bonded to someone or somebirdy they tend to stay bonded. So you're right, Darcy probably wouldn't be interested if you got a new friend for him. I wonder if all the attention from Darcy is making Bubu hormonal, even though Bubu doesn't like Darcy?

It might just be the changing of the seasons. The days are getting longer now. Not a big difference yet and nowhere near to having days that are longer than the nights, but the birds can tell the difference. I usually start seeing hormonal behavior in February and have to start using hormone control.

Casey has a forum at http://www.feathertalk.proboards.com/ if you'd like to talk to her about crazy-bird management. I do think Tsuka might actually be insane lol.



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